Debating Kane, RF, Pedo's, and more

Discuss general topics dealing with the hobby.
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AJLe
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Re: Debating Kane, RF, Pedo's, and more

Post by AJLe » August 27th, 2018, 5:43 pm

Well, if RF still owned it (and never tried to pick up a 14 year old) that would mean that Cary Silkin and later Sinclair Broadcasting did NOT ever own it, which would mean that they would likely not have the TV distribution deal they have now, nor the financial backing, which also likely means no NJPW deal as well. So although they still could be around as a kind of "super indy" that runs regionally in the Northeast, they almost definitely wouldn't be anywhere close to the level they are today had RF never cashed out when he did.


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class316
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Re: Debating Kane, RF, Pedo's, and more

Post by class316 » August 27th, 2018, 6:27 pm

AJLe wrote:
August 27th, 2018, 5:43 pm
Well, if RF still owned it (and never tried to pick up a 14 year old) that would mean that Cary Silkin and later Sinclair Broadcasting did NOT ever own it, which would mean that they would likely not have the TV distribution deal they have now, nor the financial backing, which also likely means no NJPW deal as well. So although they still could be around as a kind of "super indy" that runs regionally in the Northeast, they almost definitely wouldn't be anywhere close to the level they are today had RF never cashed out when he did.
I more meant if there were no incidents and it was business as usual and RF kept ownership.
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Re: Debating Kane, RF, Pedo's, and more

Post by AJLe » August 27th, 2018, 7:05 pm

That was my whole point - if there was no pedo incident and RF still owned it, then "business as usual" likely does NOT involve Sinclair Broadcasting, it just involves Rob, Gabe, and whoever else was involved in the front office at the time. Without Silkin and Sinclair's money, ROH was just a regional indy company that had a reputation for booking good workers. Without the financial backers that resulted from the company being sold, they're likely not flying in NJPW workers from Japan on any sort of regular basis, and they don't have nearly the TV clearance they have, if they even have a TV deal at all.

The sale of the company from the original ownership, to Silkin, to Sinclair is what made all of that growth possible. If Rob, or any of the original ownership, didn't sell and those people (or some other big money media company) never get involved, there's no way ROH is as big as it is today. Zero chance.

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Re: Debating Kane, RF, Pedo's, and more

Post by Luke » August 29th, 2018, 8:41 pm

Not only is Rob Feinstein a pedophile who cops out of it by proclaiming it's a case of entrapment but he's also a massive mark for himself and a known con artist (Forging Roddy Piper autographs anybody?)

I regularly go on eBay looking for wrestling memorabilia and this fool is trying to sell a sign from the ECW arena for a whopping 5000 dollars simply because it was in the ECW arena. 500-600 dollar item at best and he's currently trying to sell a typewriter from early 90's WCW for 1000 dollars which is pretty much a 200-300 dollar item.

The only cool thing about Feinstein's existence is that he was "kind of" involved in ECW. ECW originals hardly ever mention him apart from the fact he happened to be there but if you listen to him talk he speaks as if he was second in charge.

Feinstein is exploitative and a knob. Kane and Foley are better than working for this mark. Fuck Feinstein.

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Re: Debating Kane, RF, Pedo's, and more

Post by AJLe » August 29th, 2018, 9:01 pm

Even putting aside the pedo stuff, after the Piper forging came to light, you'd have to be an absolute fool to buy any graphs or supposedly authentic memorabilia from him. At this point, anybody who buys stuff from him deserves to get fleeced.


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Re: Debating Kane, RF, Pedo's, and more

Post by class316 » August 29th, 2018, 10:19 pm

Luke wrote:
August 29th, 2018, 8:41 pm

I regularly go on eBay looking for wrestling memorabilia and this fool is trying to sell a sign from the ECW arena for a whopping 5000 dollars simply because it was in the ECW arena. 500-600 dollar item at best and he's currently trying to sell a typewriter from early 90's WCW for 1000 dollars which is pretty much a 200-300 dollar item.
Luke! Long time how've you been?

To be fair in those instances how is that a con? He's stating exactly what they are and setting a price. That's like those Guns and Roses VIPs for 3K that get you a photo op on stage with the band's instruments. Everything is spelt out, and people apparently exist that pay the 3K because they sell out. Not a con, not illegal, not even immoral. At best you can say it is a moral rip off.
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Re: Debating Kane, RF, Pedo's, and more

Post by Luke » August 29th, 2018, 11:15 pm

class316 wrote:
August 29th, 2018, 10:19 pm
Luke wrote:
August 29th, 2018, 8:41 pm

I regularly go on eBay looking for wrestling memorabilia and this fool is trying to sell a sign from the ECW arena for a whopping 5000 dollars simply because it was in the ECW arena. 500-600 dollar item at best and he's currently trying to sell a typewriter from early 90's WCW for 1000 dollars which is pretty much a 200-300 dollar item.
Luke! Long time how've you been?

To be fair in those instances how is that a con? He's stating exactly what they are and setting a price. That's like those Guns and Roses VIPs for 3K that get you a photo op on stage with the band's instruments. Everything is spelt out, and people apparently exist that pay the 3K because they sell out. Not a con, not illegal, not even immoral. At best you can say it is a moral rip off.
Good thank you. Hope everything is well in your world :)

A moral rip off is probably the better term for it. 5000 dollars for a sign that hung up in the ECW arena for years is a complete and utter rip off. The guy was struggling to find photos of it and if you go to the auction on eBay there is actually no proof that the sign did hang up in the ECW arena. The only proof you get is Feinstein posing with it in front of the ECW arena in 2018 and a photo of him in the mid 90's with Heyman.

So even if a fan bought it they'd still have no evidence that it was actually in the ECW arena.


Image

I'd consider most of us here wrestling memorabilia experts. This sign would be the coveted ECW arena sign. It's been featured in documentaries and I assume it's been featured on ECW broadcasts also. Even this sign on auction I'd safely assume that it'd sell for around the 2000-3000 dollar mark. Maybe I'm wrong and it's sold for a lot more but in a world where you can get a pair of Eddie Guerrero's ring worn tights for just 2 grand and a full Macho Man ring worn suit (Signed) was appraised on Pawn Stars for just 7000 dollars I just don't see the ECW arena sign fetching that much let alone a vague bingo board that was allegedly in the arena.

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Re: Debating Kane, RF, Pedo's, and more

Post by Gumby » August 30th, 2018, 12:19 am

Would ROH have flourished under RF to what it is today? The world shall never know.
Yes we do. He left ROH in 2004 and his biggest power move to date has been setting up a table in a New Jersey strip mall.

A genius business mogul he ain't.
Not only is Rob Feinstein a pedophile who cops out of it by proclaiming it's a case of entrapment but he's also a massive mark for himself and a known con artist (Forging Roddy Piper autographs anybody?)

I regularly go on eBay looking for wrestling memorabilia and this fool is trying to sell a sign from the ECW arena for a whopping 5000 dollars simply because it was in the ECW arena. 500-600 dollar item at best and he's currently trying to sell a typewriter from early 90's WCW for 1000 dollars which is pretty much a 200-300 dollar item.

The only cool thing about Feinstein's existence is that he was "kind of" involved in ECW. ECW originals hardly ever mention him apart from the fact he happened to be there but if you listen to him talk he speaks as if he was second in charge.

Feinstein is exploitative and a knob. Kane and Foley are better than working for this mark. Fuck Feinstein.
Even putting aside the pedo stuff, after the Piper forging came to light, you'd have to be an absolute fool to buy any graphs or supposedly authentic memorabilia from him. At this point, anybody who buys stuff from him deserves to get fleeced.
Exactly.

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Re: Debating Kane, RF, Pedo's, and more

Post by class316 » August 30th, 2018, 3:10 am

Luke wrote:
August 29th, 2018, 11:15 pm
Good thank you. Hope everything is well in your world :)
Sadly things could be better on my end. Plus it's the one year anniversary since :fluffy: died

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Gumby wrote:
August 30th, 2018, 12:19 am
Yes we do. He left ROH in 2004 and his biggest power move to date has been setting up a table in a New Jersey strip mall.

A genius business mogul he ain't.
Genius mogul or not, the guy has been in business for like 20 years. Most people yearn to have their own business where they can be their own boss, do what they love, and still manage to pay bills and buy food. In that respect I actually envy RF.
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Re: Debating Kane, RF, Pedo's, and more

Post by oldschoolwwwf » August 31st, 2018, 8:53 am

I’m last one to defend rf but I disagree his ask price on this sign is a moral rip off. I wouldn’t want it if it was free but can’t blame the guy for trying to get as much money as possible for the sign. If he finds some idiot willing to pony up that kind of cash for it, then good for rf. If he’s looking for too much, the item will remain unsold, like a lot of overpriced eBay items. The market, or some desperate fan with some money to burn, will dictate what is overpriced or not.

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Re: Debating Kane, RF, Pedo's, and more

Post by WOODMO » August 31st, 2018, 12:43 pm

oldschoolwwwf wrote:
August 31st, 2018, 8:53 am
I’m last one to defend rf but I disagree his ask price on this sign is a moral rip off. I wouldn’t want it if it was free but can’t blame the guy for trying to get as much money as possible for the sign. If he finds some idiot willing to pony up that kind of cash for it, then good for rf. If he’s looking for too much, the item will remain unsold, like a lot of overpriced eBay items. The market, or some desperate fan with some money to burn, will dictate what is overpriced or not.
Yeah, you can always come down, but you cannot start low and go up. Business 101, and RF has made a career from selling worthless junk to fans, so why not try to do it with the sign.

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Re: Debating Kane, RF, Pedo's, and more

Post by Greg2600 » August 31st, 2018, 12:57 pm

I have a feeling he priced it super high simply to get eyeballs to his ebay store. Does that work? Ehhh, probably not, but it's a brick and mortar tactic that I've seen forever with video game collectors on ebay.
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class316
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Re: Debating Kane, RF, Pedo's, and more

Post by class316 » August 31st, 2018, 1:49 pm

oldschoolwwwf wrote:
August 31st, 2018, 8:53 am
I’m last one to defend rf but I disagree his ask price on this sign is a moral rip off. I wouldn’t want it if it was free but can’t blame the guy for trying to get as much money as possible for the sign. If he finds some idiot willing to pony up that kind of cash for it, then good for rf. If he’s looking for too much, the item will remain unsold, like a lot of overpriced eBay items. The market, or some desperate fan with some money to burn, will dictate what is overpriced or not.
What you described is basically a moral rip off. Like the Guns and Roses VIP that i mentioned
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Re: Debating Kane, RF, Pedo's, and more

Post by oldschoolwwwf » August 31st, 2018, 2:27 pm

I don’t understand the concept of a “ moral rip off”.. Someone might be overpaying, but that’s their choice. They may not consider it an overpay, therefore it isn’t. If you don’t want to pay it, you don’t. The seller isn’t morally ripping anyone off by setting an astronomical price point. If someone is willing to pay it, I guess the ask wasn’t too high.

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Re: Debating Kane, RF, Pedo's, and more

Post by AJLe » August 31st, 2018, 2:33 pm

To me, the bigger "rip off" is that with Rob's reputation, I would have zero confidence that the sign is even the legitimate sign from the Arena. So I wouldn't buy it off of HIM at any price.


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